"What a refreshingly honest blog about listening to music through hi-fi. So happy to see views based upon the enjoyment of music rather than so-called sound 'quality'." - Peter Comeau, Director of Acoustic Design at Mission / Wharfedale
Showing posts with label Logitech. Show all posts
Showing posts with label Logitech. Show all posts

Monday, 6 July 2015

ProJect MaiA Review – the shrunken integrated amp / DAC



I like to listen to music most of the time, sometimes its in the background, sometimes it makes a car journey more tolerable, sometimes I’m in the audience and sometimes I sit in front of the main hifi and just focus on listening.  Listening to the artists’ works, sometimes carried away, sometimes confused, sometimes just enjoying the flow, sometimes trying to “get” the message in the lyrics.

And sometimes, I’m away from home (quite frequently, actually).  When travelling by train or plane, I use an iPod or FiiO X3 and earbuds or phones and occasionally I have room in my suitcase for a Logitech Purefi Anywhere 2 for the hotel room.

But when travelling by car, I can take something a little more substantial to the hotel room, and have a large camera case that currently contains a pair of tiny but well made Tangent Evo speakers (no relationship to Evolution Audio, the dealer mentioned in this thread), a Trends TA 10.1 integrated t-amp and the necessary speaker and interconnects to fit to an old-style 30-pin 160GB iPod Classic or anything with a 3.5mm output (such as the FiiO or a phone).  I also carry a work laptop, sometimes used for iPlayer / other catch up services, but not currently for music.  It’s a decent listen and I prefer to listen to music through speakers rather than being tied to a device or location by a device and headphone cables.  Last thing at night, some chill tunes on a 30 minute timer on the iPod often help me get off to sleep in a strange location / room – speakers are far better for this than the need to take off headphones as I drop off to sleep.

Now that the laptop and the phone are part of the entertainment package, something with better connectivity would be useful.  In steps a HiFi Wigwam post from Evolution Audio announcing the Pro-Ject MaiA integrated amp, with analogue, digital (up to 24bit/192kHz), Bluetooth and phono (turntable) inputs.  It probably makes the toast too.  Given that Evo Audio offer a 10 day sale or return service, I thought I’d give it a go.
Now the Trends TA10.1 amp has done very well for me in this system for probably around 5 or 6 years.  Its small, runs cool, its light and has been very robust.  In the camera bag it nestles quite well wrapped in a soft wool scarf, nicely wedged between the speakers – keeping everything tightly packed but not scratching each other.  It does a decent enough job too – way better than most high street “midi” or “mini” systems.  Limitations?  Well, power, but that doesn’t matter in an hotel room when volume is necessarily limited.  Inputs? Yep – there’s only one pair of line level RCA sockets.  Remote control?  Nope.


Unboxing

Evo Audio had shipped the Pro-Ject box, wrapped in a couple of layers of bubble wrap, inside another cardboard box, along with the receipt and an Evo Audio branded pen.  Delivered in reasonable time, it even managed to survive the Hermes courier system undamaged.  Opening the Pro-Ject box revealed the amp, in a plastic bag, contained by “waffle” sponge padding on all 6 sides.  The mains cable, PSU with captive DC output lead and remote control were in a separate sub-box, with no padding around these components.  There is an 8 page instruction leaflet that’s low on content and quality, but is sufficient to get you up and running.  Clearly, the budget needed some corners to be cut, but this is a good place to do so.  The amp itself is very slim (only about 35mm high), around 200mm deep and 210mm wide,  It feels substantial though – the folded steel case and flat alu front panel are decent quality and its very well screwed together.  It gives a good first impression.  Four small rubber feet protect surfaces and help to keep the amp steady on that surface.

Around the back, there are a pair of phono sockets and a binding post for a turntable (yep, there’s and RIAA phono stage crammed in there), 2x pairs of phono sockets for line level inputs, 1x 3.5mm line level input, 1x coax RCA digital input, 2x optical digital inputs and a USB socket (for a PC, rather than an iPod or similar).  Outputs are volume controlled line level 3.5mm, and a pair of small combined binding posts and 4mm banana sockets (which are crammed close together at one end of the panel).  There’s an input for connecting the PSU’s DC cable too.  A lot going on, but clearly labelled, straight forward etc.  I used plastic shrouded 4mm bananas for speaker connections – it’s what I had already, but Paul from Evo advised this type of connection as metal bananas and bare wires are a bit risky with such closely packed connectors.  Generally, those who hoped to use in-your-face mega chunky interconnects / RCAs will be a bit disappointed, and needing to shell out for something more practical.  Bluetooth pairing was straightforward with my Android Samsung phone (Lollipop OS version).

image from ProJect Audio
image from custom-cable.co.uk


Control

Across the front there is a soft touch power on/off (tiny blue LED indicator), headphone socket, rotary volume control and a row of tiny blue LEDs indicating which source is selected – these are flanked left and right by cursor keys that move the source selection across the row of options.  Clear, simple.  The credit card sized remote gives volume control, source selection, power on/off and the ability to activate Bluetooth pairing.  Its responsive enough, but is necessarily light in weight and functional rather than a pleasure to use.  The main rotary volume control on the amp itself is a little stiff (maybe it will loosen slightly with use – hopefully not too much), but is very smooth and not so stiff that it causes the box to move on a desk.

System

For my first try with the amp (it was on 10 days sale or return remember), I used the following equipment which seems appropriate to the type of use I will put the amp to, and perhaps others will too:


  • FiiO X3 (internal DAC line out and digital coax output)
  • £8 3.5mm to 2x phono interconnect from Amazon (decent build quality, nice tight gold plated connections)
  • 99.99 OFC copper pretty standard speaker cables from Maplin – roughly 42 strand and fitted with soldered on “Shark” 4mm gold plated banana plugs
  • Tangent Evo bookshelf speakers (the ones I would intend to use the amp with) and Mission 773e floorstanders (to better expose differences between line and digital inputs)
  • Music included “Tears Run Dry” by Malia and Boris Blank; “Gaia” by James Taylor; “King” by Tuung; “Rise” by Samantha James; “Doors Unlocked and Open” by Death Cab For Cutie

Listening

I left the amp playing to itself at low volume for about 2 hours – using the FiiO line out and the Evos, just to make sure it was at least warmed through, if not exactly “burnt in”, if that’s necessary at all – its not something I’ve tested so far and won’t be bothering as it seems a bit of an overkill for this kind of product.

Kicking off with the TA10.1 amp, I reminded myself of its capabilities.  Its fast, a touch on the bright side (but not excessively so), and its best listened to at medium volumes – it gets harsh quite quickly as the volume is cranked up, but is a rather dull affair at the lower volume levels.  So about right for the job really, and good value at £110 about 5 years ago.  It has been reviewed in some quarters as a “giant killer” and paired with very exotic speakers on some web sites.  It is astonishingly good for its size and price, but that’s all.  A healthy NAD 3120 from the 1980s shows it a clean pair of heels in terms of musical enjoyment and information extraction, if not exactly neutrality.  Lets just say the TA is great for what it is and is very neutral (with the exception of that slight uplift in the higher frequencies).  But its also rather “grey” to listen to – it doesn’t have much verve or life to it.

Swapping over to the MaiA and it was initially difficult to try and get a perceptually similar volume level.  And that’s because it has a greater perceived (or real, who knows?) dynamic range – the quieter bits are that much quieter than the Trends, but equally, the louder bits are that much louder too.  It better shows through the subtleties the artist has put into the emphasis or de-emphasis of a phrase.  Nice.  So a quick switch back and forth helps to work out where to position each volume control to get as close as I could to something like equality.  Next thing to notice is what appears to be a flatter response – its easy to note that it has less emphasis at the top end, but it is still a touch bright.  Its showing the splashy nature of the FiiO’s DAC well too – this is something I noted when working out which system to go with at Scalford this year – the FiiO’s top end is pretty unruly on the internal DAC.

The MaiA manages somewhat better separation of instruments too – its not epically etching them out, but they are easier to distinguish, as is the location in the image and the stability of that image.  A welcome improvement over the TA.  What of the bass – well, there seems to be a little more of that with the Pro-Ject, and its worth having with the tiny little Tangent speakers.  Music bounces along with a reasonable sense of pace and rhythm.  Its not the last word in refinement, but you can tell the intention is to provide a bit of fun with the music.

DAC

What of the internal DAC?  Well, in this appraisal, I only had the FiiO to hand to compare, but that’s OK, because that’s what I’ll be mostly listening to.  Comparing the FiiO’s internal DAC and line out to the MaiA’s internal DAC again gave some volume control setting challenges.  I didn’t use any equipment to sort this, just a number of back to back comparisons to get a feel for where the control needed to be set.  This comparison did reveal one thing very quickly indeed – the MaiA has a much better controlled and smoother sounding DAC in comparison with the X3.  But it doesn’t image or separate the instruments any better, and has a tendency to suppress female vocals a touch.  Rhythm and pace are still good, with bass perhaps a touch more fulsome than with the X3.  I think it’s a bit swings and roundabouts really, but with the Tangent Evos being a lightweight sounding speaker, the better controlled top end and weightier bottom notes won out for me.  You might come to a different conclusion, so it’s a preferences thing rather than anything clear cut.
Proper Speakers

And what of the performance with the Mission 773e?  These were used at Scalford to reasonably good effect in 2014 and whilst not the last word in lower end speaker technology, they’re effective and enjoyable to listen to.  Normally they are fed by an SBT / MF V-DAC1 / MF V-PSU2 and a Cyrus 6 integrated amp when they’re pretty fast, boogie well and deliver a good performance.  On the MaiA, however, it was quickly noted that all wasn’t what it could be.  That fuller lower end, which worked so well when working with the little Tangents, became somewhat unruly, fat and a bit woolly.  Not great.  The effect was the same with the FiiO’s DAC back in action – slightly less noticeable, but still not really something I’d want to spend a long time listening to.  And the splashiness was back too.

£400

So all this tech and connectivity, squeezed into a small box comes at a very reasonable price.  It would be good to compare this amp with a NAD D3020, and that might be on the agenda at some point in the future.  It fits my use case for it very well, brings a useful increase in sound quality and a massive step up in connectivity and usability.  When the 10 day trial is over, it won’t be going back to the helpful team at Evolution Audio – it already has its place in the camera bag.

So to use this in a kitchen / bedroom / study or as a semi-portable system with a small set of (not too good at lots of bass) budget bookshelf speakers, I would say this amp is a success.  For me, that’s where it does a great job, just don’t expect it to cope as a main system centre piece with a pair of full range speakers.

One final thought – if all that modern connectivity, compact size and sensible pricing gets it into a good number of student bedsits, perhaps a TT connected to some of them, it might well be the way to generate a new set of audio enthusiasts.  Lets just hope they don’t get underwhelmed and miss out on the capabilities of this amp by feeding it a load of compressed MP3 junk data!

Friday, 3 October 2014

Tunes In The Garage

Assembling cheap but good secondhand stuff, listening for a while and selling on is part of how I keep my urgings to change kit in the main system at bay.

The main system stays relatively static, with the occaissional step forward when funds allow, but messing about with old stuff that was well respected in its day allows for the sampling of lots of kit whilst not breaking the bank.  Some of it sells for less than I paid, some for more and some for about the same.  Rough with the smooth and all that.

Then there are the bits that hang around for a bit longer.  They're still cheap, but are worth slotting into music somewhere about the house.

So here's the current system in the garage.  Listening to tunes when working on the car or the bikes or just tidying the place up makes the work seem less arduous.  Plus, during the winter, I'll plug the laptop into the system and watch some DVDs or cycling vids on YouTube whilst I try and become less unfit with the bike on the turbo trainer



So this £250 system consists of Squeezebox Touch (connected to QNAP NAS via Ethernet over mains), NAD 1240 pre-amp, NAD 2155 power amp and Mission 773e speakers (the earlier version with the leather look baffle trim.  Speakers hang from a shelf on the rafters, hence they're upside down.  This keeps them off the floor (which is good as that's a pretty in-hospitable environment - both for water when the car comes in wet and the danger of being kicked / damaged by box shifting etc).  They're upside down as they are floor standing speakers, so the theory is that the large shelf on the rafters is acting as though they were standing on a floor.

Wednesday, 29 June 2011

End of an Era

How long should you hang on to something that you aspired to, but no longer use?

Deep philosophy?  Not really, just one of the thoughts that went into a pretty significant decision for me.  The item in question is my Linn Sondek LP12.  About 7 years ago, it was a major upgrade from a Thorens TD160 MkII with a Mayware Formula IV Mk3 arm.  Full spec of the LP12 on "previously cherished" purchase was:

- Black Ash corner braced plinth
- Trampolin base
- Latest springs and gromets
- AC motor
- Valhalla power supply
- Cirkus bearing
- Linn Ittok LVII arm
- Dynavector DV20HX high output moving coil cartridge
- Clear lid
- Rega felt mat

As I said, a major upgrade from the Thorens and sounding rather good in comparison - excellent timing, super smooth sweet treble and clear, open vocals.  A bit of the well-known lower mid / upper bass muddiness too.

After about 3 years something went horribly wrong in the power supply / motor department - with the motor just juddering and not turning.  Not being sure if it was a motor or Valhalla fault I did some research and didn't really find out anything conclusive except for one thing - everyone (including some hifi mags) who had tried an Origin Live DC motor kit were raving about how much better it makes the LP12 sound, so I took the plunge.  I have to concur with the reviews I'd seen - it adds dynamics and removes much of the upper bass muddiness, so an excellent upgrade.  Some say this is better than a Lingo, but I've never done a back to back comparison, so I can't comment.

Its probably worth mentioning here that I don't have a huge collection of vinyl - probably under 200 discs (albums and 12" singles) so the LP12 has always been a bit of an indulgent luxury.  As for sound, I find that the LP12 does sweet treble smoothness and female vocals better than the Meridian 508.20 CD player, but CD does much better control of the bass lines and is far more dynamic - so each have their compromises and its difficult to say which is better, but I find myself listening to CD much more because I have a much larger collection of disks.

Which brings us to the point at which I've now got a streaming device (Logitech Squeezebox Touch and Cyrus DAC-X) that outperforms the CD and the LP12.  Given the visit to the hifi shop where we heard the lowest "proper" Linn streamer, the Majik DS outperform the Touch / Cyrus DAC-X and working out that I have played vinyl about 3 times so far in 2011, then the need to keep the LP12 became quite difficult to justify.  Its a great looking bit of kit and makes for a "proper" and complete hifi system so it took me a few weeks to work from the logical conclusion through the illogical and irrational desire to keep the deck and finally arrive at a decision.

So the LP12 went up on ebay to generate some funds to buy a high quality streamer and has found a new home with someone who has had a lower spec Sondek in the past and is going back to his vinyl collection.  Great to see that its gone to a caring and very happy new owner.  I wish it well for the future and hope that it now give someone lots of great music listening sessions rather than just collecting dust in our house.

Friday, 17 June 2011

Streamers and DACs from Linn, Cyrus, Logitech, Rega and Naim

Spent an interesting couple of hours in the hifi shop this afternoon with Naim enthusiast Richard trying some streaming / DAC combinations.  The excuse was created from having to pick up my newly serviced Cyrus DAC-X.

Objective - is it the streaming or the DAC that makes the difference?

Kit tested:

Linn Majik DS (as streamer and with internal DAC)
Logitech Squeezebox Touch (as streamer and with internal DAC)
Naim NDX (only as a combined unit)
Cyrus DAC-X (no PSX-R)
Cyrus Stream XP (as streamer and with internal DAC)
Rega DAC

System consisted of Cyrus 8 XPdQX integrated amp and a pair of Cabasse Artis Baltic Evolutions with their subwoofer.  Not sure what the speaker cables were, but the interconnects were from Atlas.  For the comparisons we used 16 bit CD rips in FLAC from Florence & The Machine and Elbow.

Lets get the speakers out of the way first.  I would describe them as an acquired taste, but its not a taste I acquired in the 2 hours in the shop.  They're too high, leading to a rather distant and detached soundstage and the subwoofer isn't well integrated with a somewhat underwhelming bass that lacks any real weight or slam - that could be down to how well they were set up of course.  They do have an excellent mid-range though, producing some really stunning female vocals.  The top end is ultra detailed, but can lead to some brittleness, particularly with some of the combinations we heard this afternoon.  They were, however, quite capable of showing the differences between the source components - the notes below refer to subjective differences and personal opinion - its not about absolutes.

So we kicked off with the Touch / DAC-X which I normally listen to at home, albeit it normally has a PSX-R playing along.  The sound was good, within what I think are fairly compromising limits of the speakers with some confusion on complex passages.

Next up is the Linn as streamer and DAC and here we get a decent step up in performance - more detail, much more space around the instruments and better playing of the tune.  The complex passages are better resolved too.

So which is making the biggest difference - the streaming bit or the DAC?  We hook up the Linn as a streamer into the DAC-X and find that this makes the music somewhere between the Touch / DAC-X and the complete Linn solution.  So its true, the streaming 0s and 1s bit really does make a difference and the Linn as a streamer is a worthwhile upgrade over the Touch as a streamer.

What next? We went back to the Touch and used its internal DAC.  Its very polite, a little muddled and dynamically a little flat.  Let's try that Stream XP with its internal DAC and see how Cyrus's latest performs.  Well, its better than the Touch, and gives a good account of itsself, but its not as big an upgrade as you would expect for £1400 extra investment.  So we go back to Touch / DAC-X for a while and then to the Stream XP as streamer only feeding the DAC-X and we find that the Stream XP is a better streamer than the Touch and the DAC-X is significantly better than the DAC inside the Stream XP.  This is a good sounding combination, but at £2600 (I'm allowing for the DAC-X's list price when it was new, rather than what I paid for it) it's not competing with the £1880 Linn.

The Stream XP was a bit of a disappointment as a complete streamer / DAC, but performed well as a streamer into the DAC-X and equalled the Linn /  DAC-X but not the Linn as a complete unit.

So in comes the NDX.  And here we have the typical Naim sound - very detailed (probably a very small amount of detail more than the Linn) and very pacey.  But we agreed it was all a bit too much and rather aggressive - going back to the Linn was a joy - much more musical and the music has time to flow much more than it does on the Naim.  Even Naim fan Richard agreed that the Linn was producing the best sounds we'd heard.

So that was the main session that we'd planned to go through.  Richard's interested in a DAC for his second system that currently uses a Touch only so we gave the Touch / Rega combination a try.  This is a good DAC - very refined and smooth but I was hoping for more, having seen the reviews and forum recommendations.  Keeping the Touch as a streamer we compared the Rega and DAC-X DACs, finding that the DAC-X is a better sounding piece of kit in this particular system - being more detailed and more dynamic without being overpowering.

We finished with some more tracks on the Linn including some 24 bit stuff.  Interestingly the difference between a 16 bit CD rip and a 24 bit version of the same track brings a much bigger difference on the Linn than you can differentiate on the Touch.  Some great music playing here, within what I think are some pretty severe limitations in the speakers.  Still need to hear it in my own system of course.

So here's our conclusion for you to pick apart!  Best to least best with prices just to add a bit more interest:

Linn Majik DS streamer and DAC    £1880
Linn Majik DS streamer and Cyrus DAC-X     £2880
Cyrus Stream XP as streamer and Cyrus DAC-X     £2600
Naim NDX streamer and DAC     £3000
Touch streamer and Cyrus DAC-X     £1200
Cyrus Stream XP as streamer and DAC £1400
Touch streamer and Rega DAC     £700
Touch streamer and DAC     £200

We didn't try the Cyrus Stream XP / Rega DAC combination.

Sunday, 29 May 2011

On A Mission

Local Naim enthusiast R has a new job, which is great news.  Less great is that it involves staying away from his Naim system during the week, returning at weekends.

So that could be a real downer, but R decided that he needed something to listen to his music during the week in the digs.  We dug out my portable kit and had a long natter about the best approach to take.  Whilst we listened to some music via iPod Classic (320kbps AAC files) through the Trends Audio TA10.1 integrated amp and Tangent Evo speakers we agreed that it was a decent enough sound, given the size of the amp and speakers involved.  The discussion then moved on to the "use case" and it became clear that a compact permanent system would fit the bill better than a truly portable system - R's not moving from hotel to hotel on a regular basis.

We thought about cost effective options for amps / integrated systems.  We both have Denon DM compact systems (amp / CD / Tuner) for kitchen use and they're adequate for that role but not really something you'd want to sit in front of and do some actual listening.  R has also heard an Arcam solo and was unimpressed, given the coverage its had in the press.  Thoughts turn to eBay and what the options might be if we think about used kit. I really think the TA10.1 could do the job, but R obviously feels something more substantial is required.  With both budget (Denon) and supposedly mid-range (Arcam Solo) integrated systems discounted on grounds of poor performance we moved towards integrated amps and the options there.  Sources then come to mind and we soon agreed that CD isn't a good option (R would have to take them to and from home each week) and some kind of digital file playing source would be best.  iPod?  Well, files would be best re-rippped into lossless Apple format and storage would continue to be an issue.  We've been discussing streaming options for some time and R has started ripping CDs to FLAC in anticipation of making a decision in that direction fairly soon - he's heard the Logitech Touch in action in my system and sees (and hears!) the benefits.  Being a Naim advocate meant that the UnitiQute was a possible all-in-one option and it has sounded OK on the dealer's shop floor.  But £1300 with speakers to add is a big chunk of cash to sink into a possibly temporary system and detracts from investment in the main home system.

So back to the amp.  You can seem some stuff about Cyrus in the posts below - my brother runs all Cyrus electronics and my system is running a DAC-X / PSX-R with great results.  There's one thing that Cyrus is famous for and that's their pretty much unique approach to putting all their kit into the same shoe-box size cases - somewhat more compact than the usual integrateds from other companies.  I have a couple of Logitech Touches still in their boxes ready to go into the Dining Room and Kitchen.  So a temporary source is worked out - plug a USB memory stick loaded with FLAC files into the back of the Touch and away you go.  Of course, you won't get much music on a USB stick, but it would allow us to prove the point.

At the end of the first discussion, we have a plan - Touch, Cyrus amp and some speakers.  Off R went, armed with a Touch and his eBay account for another week away.

News comes through mid-week that a Cyrus 8 has been secured on eBay at a very very good price (the silver ones seem to sell for a little less than the black ones), leaving the way clear for a bit of speaker experimentation at the following weekend.



R arrives on Friday night with said Cyrus, he's had the Touch up and running from a USB stick and there's a 2TB portable desktop drive waiting to receive lots of ripped CDs. One day (actually it might be a few days effort) I'll put a whole page up on the blog about some experimentation I went through with pre-year 2000 Mission speakers a couple of years ago, but for the purposes of this post, it means that I've a small collection of their speakers in the garage - the ones that came out best in my experiments and I felt would be good to hang on to, plus, there's a pair of 771e on Atacama SE20 stands doing great service in our Dining room.  So we have some tiny Monitor Audios that R brings along, and then Mission 771e (turn of the millenium), 737R (late 1980s) and 773 (turn of the millenium) speakers to play with. The Cyrus 8 is placed on an Isolplat on top of a Quadraspire rack and my Logitech Touch (streaming FLAC from NAS over Ethernet) is hooked up using Linn Black analogue interconnects.  R has brought some solid core speaker cables (I can't remember which - I'll amend the post later with the correct info) and we start with the tiny Monitor Audios.  The set up isn't ideal - all the speakers are stood in my listening room in front of the Linn Keilidhs so its not the best way to listen.  They're well into the room but they'll all be put through the same circumstances so we'll be able to spot differences but won't be hearing any of them at their best.  We don't listen to the MAs for long - there's loads of detail, not much bass - but what is there is OK - and female vocals are very enjoyable. But its all rather bright / harsh and I don't think they sound as good as the Tangent Evos.  We quickly move on to the 771e on the Atacama stands (which are 2/3 sand filled) and there is a massive jump in quality.  There's a quite suprising amount of bass out of these boxes, the treble is smoothed out significantly and there's a good deal more drive to the music.  We listen to some of our "standard" listening tracks such as Eagle Eye Cherry's "Shooting Up In Vain", Steely Dan's "Babylon Sisters" in 24/96 format and FAC15's take on Judie Tzuke's classic "Stay With Me Til Dawn".  We enjoy them all and agree that the 771e are very acceptable. 

Mission 771e (identity info - 771 has a silver bass driver centre cap, the 771e has gold)


We carry them out (the stands are heavy!) and in come the floor standing 773 - they're no wider nor deeper than the 771 but they're 923mm tall so they sit the tweeter higher in the room.  The 773 and 771 share the same drivers - a 25mm silk dome tweeter and a 130mm Aerogel bass cone, but the 773 adds a second bass driver.  The results are astonishing.  R's reaction forces some choice language - he can't believe we're listening to a pair of speakers you can pick up for under £100.  They're great - bass is deep, extended and articulate, vocals clear and imaging is good, if not as good as Mission's best in this regard.  We listen to several more tracks just to make sure.  If you listen to them reasonably loud they do a great job, quieter they remain dynamic, but crank up the Cyrus too much (for the speakers, not the amp) they do harden up somewhat.  But that won't matter - the quiet to medium volume range is all that will be possible in R's digs.  We decide that this combination (even using the rather limited DAC built into the Logitech Touch) is a very acceptable system and one that would be easy to live with in terms of tonal qualities and information retrieval.

Mission 773




We move onto the last option we have available to us - the late 1980s Mission 737R. Read about them on the Internet and you'll see lots of references to the "legendary" 737 Renaissance (the R stands for Renaissance which is printed in large black letters on the old skool front baffle which is painted in a dark silver dimpled finish - think Hammerite!) which was an interesting re-positioning of the "legendary" original Mission 770.  Imagine the original Mission 770's thin chipboard cabinet and the translucent 200mm polypropylene base cone coupled with the cheaper tweeter from the 700 and you get the 737R - a kind of down-market version of the 770.  At that time, the 770 had moved onto a more sophisticated cabinet and bass driver so I'm guessing this was a good way for Mission to continue to re-coup its investment in the translucent bass cone.  Anyway, I digress.  The upshot is that, following on from the 15+ years younger 773, the 737R were are a major step backwards. Good to see that Mission did make good progress over those years.  In comparison to the 773 the 737R just sounds so crude.  Bass is lighter (they benefit from being back to a wall so are distincly disadvantaged here) but its also somewhat flappy, treble is vague, bright and splashy and vocals get buried somewhere in the mix.  Pretty disappointing - they are working fine, but they're really showing their age in terms of the sound they make.  I finally realise that I can let them go - they might have been quite something in their day, but they're heavily out classed now.  Its good to hear that progress has been made.

Mission 737 Renaissance (note there are 2 versions of this speaker, one with a matt black baffle and the other with the dimpled silver finish - not sure which came first, but pretty sure from listening to them that they're otherwise of identical spec)

So we have a result - the 773 are a suprisingly good speaker, and R is off back to eBay to see what the 773 action is like.  When buying the 77 series from this era secondhand you need to look for those that are in immaculate condition because the very attractive "leather look" black vinyl front baffle covering sometimes has given up gripping onto the heavily chamfered / countered front panel.

Post script:  Having got the result we did with the 773, the 771 on Atacamas didn't go back into the Dining Room - the 773 have taken their place.  With their backs closer to a wall the 773 are sounding better still, even when driven by a lowly NAD 7020e receiver (basically a NAD 3020e amp with a built-in tuner).  A Logitech Touch is now resident in the Dining Room system too - its finally climbed out of its box.  So the second system gets a boost out of this exercise too.  R has borrowed the 771e and stands for a few weeks until a suitable pair off 773s appear on eBay.  A useful couple of hours of experiment that's lead to 2 excellent results for R and for our Dining room.  R's also taken away some Linn K20 speaker cable to compare against the solid core stuff - will report his findings soon.

Thursday, 19 May 2011

Cambridge Audio NP 30 - At Last!

After over a year of waiting, the NP 30 is finally coming to the UK.

Priced at £399 it sits between the Logitech Touch and the Cyrus Stream X, but closest to the Logitech in both price and funcitionality, given that it contains a DAC.  It will be interesting to see how the sound quality compares.

What HiFi News Article
Cambridge Audio Pages

Being uPnP based it doesn't need software installing on a PC or on a NAS and that's got to be a good thing.  Also good to see that it has a coax SP/DIF output so that other, better, DACs can be used when the time comes to upgraded.  Looks good too - purely on the cosmetics it looks like a more up market product compared to the DACMagic.

There's an Apple iWotsits app which looks fine in the screenshots - it will be interesting to see if it can overcome the issues of lag that many of these apps suffer from.

I look forward to the reviews.

Monday, 7 March 2011

DAC. Magic?

For those of you paying attention, the streaming set up currently looks like this:
QNAP NAS (including SqueezeServer software) - Etnernet over mains - Logitech Squeezebox Touch - QED Performance Digital Coax cable - Cambridge Audio DACMagic - Audioquest Emerald analogue interconnect - Meridian 541 pre-amp and then off into the active amps and Linn Keilidhs.

And very satisfying it is too - as I've said earlier, about 90% up there with the CD player, and definitely better with 24 bit tracks.  But there's always that nagging doubt eh?

Now some sites (e.g. Stereophile, Digital Audio Blog) have been making some seriously big claims for the capability of the Logitech Squeezebox Touch - such as "the best transport I've ever heard (Digital Audio Blog on the Touch with a Teddy PSU)".  This means they've been running the humble Touch with some multi $k DACs and stratospherically expensive amps and speakers.

I am, by nature, somewhat sceptical of such claims and what sometime seems to by hyperbole.  Now I'm not singling out Stereophile nor Digital Audio Blog or questioning their integrity, it just that I like to see lots of evidence and corroboration, or better still, find out for myself.

Another thing that's a worthwhile background to this post is my continuing good natured sibling "rivalry" with my brother when it comes to hifi and the route to getting the most enjoyable sound in the home.  Brother J has gone down a different route to myself, (although we initially shared an enjoyment of Meridian CD players, with J running a 206 for many years.  After a few years with Meridian CD / Cyrus 2 / PSX and Mission 770 Freedoms (the last of the 770 line) he's recently upgraded to a Cyrus 4 box CD player (I can't remember the transport model, but the other three boxes are DAC X and 2 PSX-Rs) plus a reasonably high end Cyrus integrated.  This has substantially improved his whole system and it suits his taste - its fast, has pin-point imaging and real clarity and separation.  But for me, it doesn't go deep enough, the music lacks somewhat in emotion and doesn't "envelope" the listener.  Its all silver too, which just isn't right ;-) Each to his own of course, and it delivers what he wants to hear.  This means he finds my system to be somewhat vague in its imaging (can't argue with that) and a little less analytical than he would enjoy.  Fair enough.  Will do a feature on the "other systems I have known" page sometime soon.

Why is this relevant?  Well, in amongst J's kit list you might have spotted a somewhat fine DAC combination of Cyrus DAC X and PSX-R.  This half term (this is a very late post, apologies!), J came to visit with family and had kindly agreed to bring along said DAC and power supply.  It's good to unplug and re-connect cables every now and then, make sure the connections are clean!  And so began a "quick trial" session - we reckoned an hour would be enough...

For purposes of this session, we used exclusively 16 bit 44.1 kHz FLAC files ripped from my CD collection - so we could make direct comparison with my Meridian 508.20 CD player.
Music used:

Thea Gilmore - Loft Music - Tracks "Ever Fallen In Love" and "The Old Laughing Lady" (A great covers album - with Thea its all about her extraordinary voice - its range and ability to convey emotions, plus the acoustic instruments and backing vocals)
Brendan Perry - Eye of the Hunter - Track "Death Will Be My Bride" (Don't listen if you're feeling a bit down!  Very well recorded and spacious track with some really tricky and complex cymbals to deal with)
Eagle Eye Cherry - Desireless - Track "Shooting Up In Vain" (Another one to cheer you up! Mutilayered instruments that need a good system to allow each instrument to survive in the complexity of the mix)
Chris Rea - The Road to Hell - Track "Looking for a Rainbow" (needs a system that has good drive and pace as the song builds the underlying rythmn throughout)
Eddi Reader - Eddi Reader - Track "Dear John" (lovely voice, needs to convey the emotions)
FAC 15 - On Fierce Angel's Angels Fall 3 CD Set "Stay With Me Till Dawn" (a superb re-work of the Judie Tzuke classic with a bass line that slides into the depths of the unknown!)

To get a reference and to demo the DACMagic to J we started off using the Thea Gilmore album to play the Touch with its internal DAC and then stepped up to the DACMagic.  J's view largely aligned with mine - a massive improvement somewhat out of kilter with this modestly priced most looking little black box.  Comparing to the CD player there are aspects of the music that are different but we couldn't really choose between Touch / DAC and the CD player.  CD being warmer, Touch being a bit more up-front.  Tried Eagle Eye and Chris Rea on this too, with similar indecision.

So the Cyrus DAC X is unpacked and plugged in to the system.  It sits on an Isoplat and takes the place of the DACMagic in support of the Touch for the streaming side of the system.  What follows is somewhat of a revelation.  Usually, when you get to this stage with hifi, the improvements in the system deminish, the more you spend on the system.  One day I'll post in depth on the benefits of going from passive amplification to active amplification with the Linn Keilidhs which was the biggest single improvement I've made in my system.  Until now.  For those of you who've had the benefit of listening to a Linn or Naim system that has been moved from passive to active, you'll know just how fundamental a change this Cyrus shoebox has brought to the system.

Cyrus DAC-X in brushed black


Some examples of what we heard:
- The music appears to be playing slower (but it takes the same length of time to play the track) this would seem to be because the instruments and/or notes aren't slurring into each other, they've got time and room to be notes in their own right
- One of the tracks (can't remember which one) has a riff played on an acoustic guitar.  As the track progresses and more joins the mix, the guitar continues in the background.  But we were both astonished to hear (and we both spotted this at exactly the same moment, without discussion) that part way through the track the guitar changes from acoustic to steel.
- The Brendan Perry track finishes with a very complex and subtle cymbal sequence.  Now, the difference between the sound of each cymbal is much more obvious, but on top of that, you can hear if the stick is striking the top or the edge of the cymbal and when being brushed, if the brushing is being done by a brush or by a stick.
- The soundstage on all tracks is outside the speakers and with the FAC15 track, fills out into the room.

So we were VERY impressed with this and messed about with a few tracks for another hour or so.  Then outcame the Cyrus PSX-R to sit alongside the DAC-X.  You need to keep both the DAC and the PSX-R plugged into the mains then there's an umbilical chord from the PSX-R to the DAC.  I understand that the internal power supply of the DAC is then dedicated to digital duties and the PSX-R takes over the analogue output circuits.

So what now?  Well this is another non-subtle improvement.  Darkness behind and around instruments, bass is deeper and more controlled (check the sliding synth bass line on the FAC15 track) and those Brendan Perry cymbals shimmer out and away from the speakers, seeming to sit in the room.  FAC15 are now enveloping the whole room.  Its lush, detailed and completely captivating.  And so the quick listening session went on for 3.5 hours.  We didn't want to stop trying different tracks.  Later in the evening, the system seemed to have matured again - I know many experience this with their systems and there is much debate about noise on the mains. physcological effects and many other theories. Perhaps this would've happened anyway, but we did suspect that the PSX-R might have warmed through a little?

We, rather indulgently, spent another couple of hours of listening the following day, throwing in some 24bit stuff from Linn and HDTracks, which, of course, was mighty impressive, if, at times, a little dry.  No problems with Ian Shaw's "Barangrill" (on "Drawn To All Things" from Linn Records) nor with Steely Dan's "Hey Nineteen" (on Gaucho from HDTracks).

And then J and his Cyrus kit went away again.  Sad.  But one thing has definitely been proven - the little Squeezebox Touch is certainly capable of supporting some very serious downstream electronics.  Now to eBay...

Friday, 25 February 2011

Squeezebox Touch - Evolution Begins

No changes to the rest of the system (although there is a bit relating to cables...) so this is the first stages of experimentation with streaming audio and how it relates to the Logitech Squeezebox Touch in my system.  For the first part of this story, see the posting First Streaming Times below.
So we are at a Touch on its own into the rest of the system using a pair of Linn Black analogue interconnects.  And it sounds very detailed but flat, lacking space between the instruments, there's little width to the sound and its all lacking somewhat in terms of drive / pace / enthusiasm.  Its fine for background listening, but not so good for listening to music properly.  The CD player is still in a different league.  These comparisons are done between the same CD and the ripped version in FLAC, not against high res files which would be an unfair comparison.
 
Some research revealled that quite a few folks have been running external DACs on their Squeezebox Duets and Touches with some success, and there are various references to different (e.g. Fidelity Audio, Teddy PS) external power supplies making a difference.
There's then a whole separate story about a chance opportunity to go to a Naim dealer when Naim themselves were there demoing loads of kit.  I might write that one up sometime.  But the key relevant point here is that Naim have come out with a streaming device that sounds distinctly unimpressive to me when using its internal DAC, but plug it into the Naim stand alone DAC and it sounds astonishingly good.  Add the external power supply to the external DAC and you have something quite remarkable, but also rather expensive (approx £6.5k at this point).  So this, coupled with the internet chattosphere spurred me on to further experimenting.
I took the plunge and bought a Cambridge Audio DACMagic (for those with an eye for absolute detail, its a black one) along with the CA basic optical digital interconnect.  This is a major step forward and unleashes all sorts of extra information, deeper bass and the soundstage leaps out from between the speakers and pretty much doubles in width.  Hmm, very interesting.  If I then move the interconnect from the CD player (its an AudioQuest Topaz) there are further improvements in control and bass extension.  I purchased a What HiFi recommended Chord Chameleon Silver Plus interconnect (£125) which is an improvement on the Linn, but isn't as good as the Topaz (£180 for 0.5m over 10 years ago, but thrown in when I bought the CD player).
Now if I use the DACMagic and CD player as a transport then the CD player inbuilt DAC still wins out, and that's using an optical digital interconnect (not tried with a coax interconnect yet), so the DACMagic doesn't appear to be as good as the DAC inside the CD player.  Or is it?
The reason for this doubt is because of the next step I took.  I picked up an old coax digital lead that's actually designed for Meridian components to talk to each other, but only for control purposes, so its not exactly designed with sound quality in mind.  However, the improvement of this over the optical digital lead was astonishing.  Optical appears to be rubbish - that could be the Touch output, the DACMagic input, or the cable, or some kind of combination of all or some of these. The biggest difference here is difficult to describe, but if you imagine the "space" around, between and behind instruments is blackness, then the blackness was much blacker - I guess it means there's some kind of digital error correction or hash (jitter?) disappearing from the signal? The music is now going along with some proper drive and pace.  Foot is tapping at last. So if a rubbish cable is better than an optical one, what's a decent cable like?

So in comes a fairly basic but recommended digital coax cable - a QED Performance which is only £30.  Another step forward over the basic coax, but more subtle this time - mainly in the treble area, it's lost some of the remaining grittiness and splash.  Must get around to trying the DACMagic with the CD player transport and the coax interconnect soon, just haven't had the time.
So we're now at Touch - QED coax - DACMagic - Chord Chameleon. 

Comparison with CD player is now getting about 85% of the way there.  CD player still giving a bit more in terms of punch / pace etc, but from a pure detail point of view, there's nothing in it.  CD player still using the Topaz interconnect though, which is somewhat better than the Chord Chameleon.
So off to ebay to find a secondhand Topaz (you can't buy them new anymore).  No luck there, but did find 2 pairs of Audioquest Emerald interconnects which were top of their range at around £230 for 0.5m.  Got them for £40 and £42 so one for the CD and one for the DACMagic.  So here we have yet another improvement to both Touch / DAC and the CD player.  Again its subtle but its definitely there.  How can I describe this one?  Well its a kind of smoothness and flow to the music - whilst the instruments are very seperate and obviously so, the actual music seems to flow along much better and its not a bunch of accurately rendered notes, its a better illusion of a piece of music (I almost used the word accurate there, but we know its not about accuracy, because so few of us actually know what the original performance sounded like and we need to remember that much of the processing done during production is deliberately trying to make the recording NOT sound like the original performance).  This description probably isn't making much sense, that's why I'm not Jimmy Michael Hughes!
So we have Touch - QED Coax - DACMagic - Audioquest Emerald and that's now somewhere between 90 and 95% of the way to the CD player's quality. 

But here are the 2 killer points.  It now stands me at £500 and if I was starting from scratch I'd a choice between that and the £1700 CD player, I know which I'd choose!  But as soon as you add in the ability to play 24 / 96 files then its a hands-down win for the streaming tech - its a good 10% better than the CD player and leads to those evenings that are "just one more track" until its suddenly 1am!

So you have to wonder just how much DAC the Touch can support...
And what about power supplies, and do they matter, once you're no longer using the internal DAC?
 
If you're interested in more on the Squeezebox Touch, take a look at this article as there are mods you can do to your Touch without spending any cash: